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Re: [engelang] Xorban: la je cmla nltra






From: Jorge Llambías <jjllambias@hidden.email>
To: engelang@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2012 2:52 PM
Subject: Re: [engelang] Xorban: la je cmla nltra

 
On Mon, Oct 22, 2012 at 4:16 PM, John E. Clifford <kali9putra@hidden.email> wrote:
>
> Well, that does clarify things a bit: dz is a predicate that extends the scope of a previous binder into the next sentence. Note that it is strictly unnecessary for l (and practically unnecessary in any case).

I'm not sure how "dz-" extends the scope of a previous binder. It
seems to me that we have separate bindimngs for each sentence:

na sa xjra le strde ctkake. [la dza] li rlci dksaki.
No pig oysters eats. [Pigs] are delicate in excess.

If we extended the scope of s- into the next sentence we would get the
wrong meaning:

na sa xjra je le strde ctkake li rlci dksaki.
No pig (oysters eats & is delicate in excess).
Extend the binder's scope.  If you want to do it mechanically, it would be ra xjra je na le strede ctkake li rlci dksaki.  But I suppose it is meant to be transcendental.

> Li rlci dkseki is sorta ridiculous; it assumes an ordered class with our group off at one end.

"Excessive" is just beyond a certain boundary, it doesn't have to be at the end.
Oops, should have said, "towards" ;  the ordered class is still necesssary and still odd.

> It would be more natural, it seems to me, to make the modification in the property rather than the class.

Natlangs don't seem to favor mentioning a property for this:

"This is too bright" rather than "this has too much brightness".
"This is too much of a burden" rather than "this has too much ?burdenness".
Bringing up a property seems unnecessary.
Yes, natural languages favor modifying the predicate  -- with "too" in English -- rather than referring to the class.  Since Xorban is now set up not to allow modifying a predicate, the nearest related thing is taking a modification of a property.    "This is extreme of the brights" or "this is extreme of the burdensomes"  are even stranger (well, that is debatable; they are both pretty odd).

> If you are worried, as you seem to be, about using up letters, you would be better finding a way to talk about properties -- in both senses -- than this bit of frill.

What are the two senses of properties?
Modal and Fregean: function from worlds to extensions and Sinn (not well defined, but necessary for intentions in the cognitive cases at least-- if not the representative  and perhaps to explain the modal).

co ma'a xrxe