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cu'u la .and.
None of the below is intended to imply a revision to the taxonomy of gadri types that the discussion has agreed on.
Or not....Having relapsed into fundamentalism, I go into this with the proviso that boundaries can be extrinsic (re lo djacu), and culture-specific, and Lojban by definition allows all things to be bounded or unbounded.
* The difference between broda Substance and a single individual broda.
* Intrinsic Boundaries (- can be fuzzy) = Countability
- broda Substance lacks intrinsic boundaries = is uncountable
- a single individual broda has intrinsic boundaries = is countable
Or in any case, if you call something a substance, you're ignoring any intrinsic boundaries. It is true that {loi remna cu bevri le pipno}.
* divisibility: within reason, you can arbitrarily subdivide broda
Substance and end up with broda Substance, but you can't arbitrarily
subdivide a single individual broda and end up with a single
individual broda.
Damn. That's what I said.
* Collective
* is a group of two or more broda (seen another way, a single individual
broda would be a group of one broda)
Assuming you can count broda. Which is reasonable. I still think everything sayable of a collective is also sayable of a lojbanmass, but this is more about perspective than truth conditions.
* is not Divisible: although you can divide a group into two groups,
you can't *arbitrarily* subdivide it -- you must subdivide it at
the boundaries between group members.
OK...
* may or may not have intrinsic boundaries (but a group of a definite
number of members does have intrinsic boundaries)
[Hence a MOI brivla for Collective would be compatible with both
a Substance gadri and a non-Substance gadri.]
*shrug*This-all is cool, but backward compatibility means you can switch off intrinsic boundaries, and talk in terms of extrinsic boundaries, or ignore all boundaries.
-- **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** * Dr Nick Nicholas, French & Italian Studies nickn@hidden.email * University of Melbourne, Australia http://www.opoudjis.net * "Eschewing obfuscatory verbosity of locutional rendering, the * circumscriptional appelations are excised." --- W. Mann & S. Thompson, * _Rhetorical Structure Theory: A Theory of Text Organisation_, 1987. * **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** **** ****