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Adam: > de'i li 2002-10-25 ti'u li 11:12:00 la'o zoi. And Rosta .zoi cusku di'e > > >> and so 'mi nelci lo'ei cakla' is far too general to be useful in > >> translating 'I like chocolate.' > > > >Yes. It's really useful for "I need chocolate", though > > Yes, and also for lion tamers and man-eating sharks, though I will > use 'tu'o' for this when I don't use a tanru or lujvo. I don't think tu'o is adequate. No PA can replace it and give the desired meaning. We really either explicitly have to say what we mean, or else use lo'ei. > >> At this point I think I would still like to > >> use 'lo'e' for 'I like chococate', so I will search for another > >> formalization of the meaning; And's looks more or less promising, and > >> it also has the effect of giving a useful and o-gadri/e-gadri-like > >> distinction between lo'e/loi'e and le'e/lei'e > > > >I'm glad of this, but it would be possible to define a le'ei counterpart > >to lo'ei -- xorxes and I were discussing it yesterday. > > IIRC, xorxes defined the difference to be one of veridicality, i.e. > 'broda lo'e brode' --> 'kairbroda le ka ce'u poi'i brode' and 'broda > le'e brode' > --> 'kairbroda le ka ce'u voi'i brode', which is an almost useless distinction > and explains why he has always used only 'lo'e' ... but I gave a more useful definition for le'ei: lo'ei broda = lo'ei lu'a lo'i broda le'ei broda = lo'ei lu'a le'i broda (recast from my previous formulation). Analogously: loi'e broda = loi'e lu'a lo'i broda lei'e broda = loi'e lu'a le'i broda su'o lo broda = lo lu'a lo'i broda su'o le broda = lo lu'a le'i broda ro lo broda = ro lo lu'a lo'i broda ro le broda = ro lo lu'a le'i broda & IMO: loi broda = lu'o lo'i broda lei broda = lu'o le'i broda (The "IMO" is because I don't hold with the default piro/pisu'o.) BTW, I wish there were a gadri series meaning "lu'o/lu'a/lu'i pa klesi be lo'i". I'll have to think about defining some, and then see how useful they are. --And.