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I do know what you mean. 12--15 years ago when I was devoting tons of time and energy to Lojban I felt -- rightly, I still think -- that I was largely wasting my time but -- rightly, I think -- found it hard to surrender the struggle. Even nowadays my much lesser present-day involvement feels like a waste of time and effort, relative to what else I could be devoting it to. But although I retain a kind of affection for Lojban, and a less alloyed affection for Lojbanistan, my driving goal was always an ergonomic loglang, and it's that that colours my view of Lojban -- fair or not, I find it hard to forgive it for not being the ergonomic loglang it gives off the mirage of being. Because I feel I've wasted quite a bit of my life on Lojban, I cannot sincerely reassure you, much tho I'd like to, that you aren't similarly wasting yours.
But my views shouldn't poison others' views of Lojban, unless their interest in Lojban is based on the forlorn wish for it to be an ergonomic loglang. Lojban has its own quirky character and an attractive user-community; to adapt xkcd, an attraction of using Lojban is that you get to interact with the sort of people that want to use Lojban. To embrace Lojban you must embrace its badness of design, find beauty in its ugliness and cackhandedness; like with natlangs, and like with people, you have to just accept it as it is; but it's altogether possible to do that (tho not for me).
To anyone who shares my wish for a loglang, my advice depends on how you prioritize (A) having one that is definitely good enough, (B) having one you could definitely be using in the near future, and (C) having one with a community of users now or very soon. If (C), focus on sorting out Lojban. If (B), work on finishing Xorban or similar. If (A), work on the project I outlined in my previous message. When the design for (A) is done (if it is doable), I think its superiority will be self-evident and users will adopt it just as happens with other big saltations in technology, such as smartphones. But who knows how long it will take to get there...
--And.
la .and. cu cusku di'e
> Incidentally, there is a difference between (A) a version of Lojban
> tinkered with enough to make it a loglang and (B) an ergonomically
> adequate loglang. In this message I have been discussing (B). But it's
> (A) that would liberate diehard conservative lojbanists from tinkering.
> Forking Lojban will lead to (A) not to (B). I think the world needs (B).
Everytime you say that ("lojban is not a loglang", "lojban is a terrible
language" :P ), I die a little inside, even though I think I agree with
you that one can do much better than Lojban did. The thing is just that
I'm working on big Lojban projects and most of my free time is spent
thinking about the language and related projects, so that each time I
hear how bad Lojban is, there is a voice inside me that wants to agree,
but at the same time it makes me question the very point of spending
time with Lojban at all, and if it's worth all this effort and time. I'm
scared that all I've done will be meaningless at some point in the
future when it turns out that Lojban just wasn't "it".
(I might be giving Lojban an unhealthy amount of importance in my life)
--selpahi
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Posted by: selpa'i <seladwa@hidden.email>
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