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--- Padraic Brown <elemtilas@hidden.email> wrote: > > --- Adam Walker <carrajena@hidden.email> wrote: > > > --- Padraic Brown <elemtilas@hidden.email> wrote: > > > > > > --- Adam Walker <carrajena@hidden.email> wrote: > > > > > > > This is the only day of the year when > > Eucharist > > > > is > > > > taken in the home and included as part of a > > > > meal. > > > > Otherwise it is a rite performed in the > > > > churches by > > > > the clergy and administered to the > > faithful. > > > > Each > > > > family tends to have a certain Gospel which > > is > > > > tradition within that family to read/recite > > > > from on this night. > > > > > > But doesn't a (qualified and spiritually > > whole) > > > priest still have to consecrate the bread in > > > advance? Or is the father allowed to do this > > once > > > a year? > > > > > > > You're probably right. In my church background > > any > > individual believer can bless the bread and > > wine, in > > fact, at many of the communion services I have > > participated in each believer consecrates his > > or her > > own elements. I'll have to formulate a > > Donatist > > doctrine to resolve this question. Can the > > father be > > considered the priest of the household for the > > purpose of this most holy communion? > > Unless they've diverged considerably from the > Catholic-Orthodox tradition they originally came > from, the answer would be emphatically "no". > Except that the tradition under discussion only began to emerge with Cyprian who wrote only a few years before the split took place. His ideas weren't firmly established in any tradition by the time the Donatists parted ways with Rome. I'm thinking that the independant spirit of the Berber Donatists might have encouraged some different views from those espoused by the thoroughly Latinized city folk like Cyprian. And they would have Scriptural support for such divergences, especially in I Pt. 2. > > Since he will already be > > performing some other priestly duties in simply > > distributing the elements and reading the > > Scripture. > > Some of these can be and are (*here*) delegated. > Communion, in Catholic churches, is regularly > distributed by specially authorised lay > ministers. The gospel and sermons can be > proclaimed by deacons, if authorised by the > presiding priest. > But isn't that a recent development (post Vatican II?) in the Catholic Church? > > And what about a widow, would she be permited > > as well? > > To say nothing of a woman, though early on I > understand there w�re female priests. > Yes, and the practice wasn't stamped out completely, even in Italy, until the early 400's, a hundred years after the Donatists had parted ways. > > I think yes on both counts, but this isn't set > > in stone yet. > > Wow. That was unexpected! I would have thought > that in such an ecclesiastical tradition, only a > priest would be able to enact a consecration. > Well, the Donatist ecclesiastical tradition admits female priests and has preserved the office of deaconess. Virgins and widows often function in various church offices and those married to priests or other officers of the church frequently assist in the duties of their husbands. > Even in realtively ideosyncratic Telerani > Christianity, only the priest can consecrate > bread for communion. > > Anyone ought to be able bless bread, but > consecrating is a typically priestly function. At > least in the Catholic, Orthodox and related > traditions. > > What tradition are you coming from where > individuals do it themselves? > Charismatic. And it isn't always done that way, but it is an option which is sometimes practiced. > > Thank you Padraic. Your questions and comments > > are just the thing to bring this into better > > focus for me. Interracting with you is quite > > fruitful. > > You're very welcome, and the gratitude is mutual! > I find your descriptions of C-a very interesting > as well as inspiring. > > Padraic. > Thankee well. Has thou any other icunus Carnovanus to share beside the Abgar? Adam Jin nifalud fistus todus idavi eseud adimpuudu ul isu fi aved niminchunadu pera ul Dju peu'l medju djul provedu cumvi dichid: �I�i! Cunchepijid ed nadajid il virdjini ad junu huiju, ed cuamajuns ad si il Emanueli fi s�ivigad ul Dju simu noviscu.� Machu 1:22-23