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Re: Test: Is this list dead?



Rick Morneau <ram@s...> wrote:
> "maikxlx" <maikxlx@g...> wrote:
> >
> > Dayva dayvimu,
> > 
> 
> This translates roughly as 'All of the say there!'.

Ha, dumb mistake; I forgot that 'vimu' is strictly an adjective. 
(In my conlang, an article or a vocative marker upgrades an
adjective to a noun.)  I guess I might have tried 'dayvimunti',
or would that be interpreted as inanimate?



> They are, essentially.  "Ponende" is a case tag and its linkage is 
not
> precise, while "pone" is a conjunction and its linkage IS precise.
> "Ponende" is especially useful in machine translation because the
> linkage of a natural language construction may not be clear.  It's 
also
> useful if a clause and a noun phrase has to be linked, as in:
> 
>     Goy sesku mi nango ponende tumi.
>     = I'll buy the boat depending on you.

Okay, that makes it clear.

 
 
> >
> > catsa should be tatsa.
> > 
> 
> I strongly disagree.  "Ca" has 'desire' as one of its senses which 
is
> compatible with "catsa" = 'to have as a purpose or goal'.  "Ta" has
> 'speech' as one of its senses which is compatible with "tatsa" = 'to
> mean or signify'.

Yes, but:
'letadya tatsandu ...' = 'words meaning ...'

would be preferable to:
'letadya catsandu ...' = 'words for the purpose of ...'

Correct?

 
 
> >
> > Batsa tujunti magidanzi va cansa.
> > 
> 
> "Magidanzi" (meaning 'question') is not acceptable because it 
eliminates
> the possibility of an external patient.  The correct derivation is
> "mamyagidambi".  

I was wondering about this.  I formulated that word from madanzi,
but I did think the choice of CCM was odd.



> Also, since cumulative adjective modification is left-
> to-right in Katanda, "mamyagidambi va cansa" literally means 'the 
good
> one of a question', which doesn't make sense (at least in the
> singular).  Here's the correct sentence and the computer 
translation:
> 
>     Batsa tujunti mamyagidambi cansa va.
>     = That's a good question.

I didn't anticipate that word order would result in a 
distributive interpretation with articles.  What happens 
when you have an article and an *open/heavy* adjective 
modifying the same noun?  I'm guessing you can't put 
the article after that.
 


> >
> > Mepi si mi batsandi.
> >
> 
> Good.  Computer output:
> 
>     'I was thinking about the same thing.'

It's good to see I got one sentence right!



> >
> > Xebenza mi xenidunda Katanda letadya va tatsando liku wish poku ne
> > liku hope poku ne liku wonder poku. :-)
> > 
> 
> You need to use "zane" instead of "poku ne" in a quoted list of
> conjuncts.  Also, "tatsando" should be the open 
adjective "tatsandu".

Another dumb PoS error, heh.



> Here's the correct version and the MT output:
> 
>     Xebenza mi xenidunda Katanda letadya tatsandu liku <wish>dya 
zane
> 	<hope>dya zane <wonder>dya poku.
>     = I think that Katanda needs the words meaning "wish", "hope", 
and
> 	"wonder".
> 
> Note that I got rid of "va".  Keep in mind that "va" is an 
INDEFINITE
> article.

I might not grasp Katanda articles completely (tricky in any 
language, I think.)  My intended sense was: 

"Katanda needs (some) words for 'hope', etc."

But "the words" works just as well of course.



> By the way, I agree with you. :-)  I'll get around to it eventually.
> 
> >
> > Dwiva cansampoy lemadanzi foy pone bucansanta dahi.
> > 
> 
> The same reasons for "mamyagidambi" also apply to "mamyadambi".  The
> faulty dictionary entry has been fixed.  (Thanks!)

No problem :-)



> The semi-corrected version is:
> 
>     Dwiva cansampoy lemamyadambi foy pone bucansanta dahi.
> 
> MT output:
> 
>     Please fix my statements if they'll be bad.
> 
> First of all, I would personally rather use "xetadya" = 'sentence'
> instead of "mamyadambi" = 'statement'.  Second, since imperative
> "cansampoy" is inherently future, the conjunct is also future.  
Here's
> the result:

Yes, 'sentences' is closer to my meaning.  That tense thing 
caught me off guard.  I'll keep it in mind.


 
>     Dwiva cansampoy lexetadya foy pone sa bucansanta xehi.
>     = Please fix my sentences if they are bad.
> 
> Mission accomplished!

Hehe, shakier than I expected, but at least you were able to gather 
my meaning.


Regards

---  Mike