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Invent Yourself scripsit: > If ni uses ce'u, then it can't express "the degree to which", because > that's an abstraction of a filled bridi. If ni doesn't need ce'u, then it > makes sense, but loses its symmetry with ka, and becomes completely > identical to jei. Oho! This gives me an idea. What if ni is to jei as ka is to du'u? le ka ce'u kusru la djim. = the property of being cruel to Jim le ka la djan. kusru ce'u = the property of being a victim of John's cruelty le du'u la djan. kusru la djim. = the assertion that John is cruel to Jim le ka ce'u kusru ce'u = cruelty, the relationship between cruel one and victim le ni ce'u kusru la djim = the amount of cruelty to Jim le ni la djan. ce'u kusru = the amount of being a victim of John le jei la djan. ce'u la djim. = the degree to which John is cruel to Jim le ni ce'u kusru ce'u = the amount of cruelty I think this is nicely symmetrical, useful, and as consistent with the past as can be expected. Comments? -- A poetical purist named Cowan [that's me: jcowan@hidden.email] Once put the rest of us dowan. [on xml-dev] "Your verse would be sweeter http://www.ccil.org/~cowan If it only had metre http://www.reutershealth.com And rhymes that didn't force me to frowan." [overpacked line!] --Michael Kay