[YG Conlang Archives] > [ceqli group] > messages [Date Index] [Thread Index] >
on 6/9/02 8:01 PM, Rob Speer at rob@hidden.email wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 09, 2002 at 07:14:41PM -0600, Rex May - Baloo wrote:
>> I added a place to stuj
>> x1 studies/is a student of x2 under the supervision of x3
>
> This excludes studying on one's own. That place could still be added
> with 'ho garu'.
Quite right. I'll drop it.
>
>> Changed ciwe to garu, which is the opposite of gura, teach, from Indonesian
>>
>> if fina means x1 finds out x2 about x3, could dxajfina mean 'find' in the
>> sense of locate? If so, what wd the place structure be?
>
> Okay. Something that was added to Lojban after the vocabulary was
> baselined was a method of assigning place structures to compounds that
> don't include a standard prefix or suffix (like Ceqli "gan" or "ble"
> would be). It's kind of fun when you get the hang of it, but not
> something you can usually do on the fly.
>
> The places of "fina" are discoverer, fact, object.
> The places of "dxaj" are object, location.
>
> The fact is where it is located; this will always be the same, so this
> place drops out. The object in each is the same, so those places merge
> and the place structures get spliced together there.
>
> dxajfina1 = fina1
> dxajfina2 = fina3 = dxaj1
> dxajfina3 = dxaj2
>
> Giving the place structure: x1 finds x2 in location x3. Which is
> probably what you expected anyway. You picked exactly the right words as
> components, BTW.
>
>> We need both kan and ble. to be able to and to be able to be. Vinkan
>> capable of seeing, and vinble, visible.
>
> What you're trying to solve is already taken care of with place
> structure.
>
> vinble = capable of seeing
> bervinble = visible
Hm. Sure. Now, we really need to decide what to do about this -r ending.
If we use -r to convert a smalvor into a preya, then all words of the form
CV(V)r are going to look like converted smalvor. Is that okay? If it is,
then we have to be careful not to make a CV(V)r that we _need_ for that
purpose. Or should we restrict CV(V)r to derivations of CV(V)'s?
>
> Though I do like "ble" for this. It's more distinguishable from another
> very common suffix, "gan".
I do, too. So shall we replace kan with ble both as a word and a suffix?
>
>> You need to explain how
>> den * djedi full day x1 is x2 full days in duration (default 1)
>> works. And while we're at it, let's make it djen, more like its Russian
>> origin.
>
> "djedi" in Lojban is one of the unit words. Units in Lojban are a bit
> odd.
>
> If you want to say that you are two meters tall, you say "mi mitre li
> re" ("I am-meters-long the-number two"). (To refer specifically to your
> height, replace "mi" with "leni mi galtu", but that's not important.) If
> you want to say that you waited for five minutes, you say "mi pu denpa
> ca lo mentu be li mu" ("I (past) wait during a minute-duration of
> the-number five"). Simply saying "mu mentu" ("five minutes") doesn't
> work because it doesn't say that they were five consecutive minutes.
Believe it or not, I think I thought something like this stuff up for
Loglan, back when the wouldn't use numbers to nominalize predicates. I said
they should say "I have dollar threesome." for "I have three dollars." So I
like it, tho it'll be a trick to get used to it.
>
> So a day is no different than any other unit of time.
>
> It's a bit strange, but it seems that the alternative would be to make
> units a separate mechanism in the language. (Loglan's method, where "50
> centimeters" was expressed as a number with digits five, zero, C, and M,
> would _not_ be satisfactory.)
>
> The keyword is "full day" because there will be another word farther
> down the list, Lojban "donri", meaning "daytime".
>
>> I changed ban to boli, from Hindi for language
>
> "language" is used a lot in compounds.
>
> For example, say that "French" is "frane". If you want to refer to French
> people you could say "franeper", and with this if you want to refer to
> the French language you'd say "franeboli". And for consistency, the Ceqli
> language would be referred to specifically with "ceqliboli".
>
> Perhaps something besides "ban" would still be good, as I see
> disturbingly assonant compounds like "franeban" and "spanoban" arising,
> but it should be a single syllable.
>
> Perhaps "bli"?
Right again. We could have 'tal' from Dutch, Cantonese goq, meaning speak,
or truncated English 'spi'. I'm inclined to spi, myself. You?
>
>> replaced cjem (member) with tclen, from russian.
>
> That's a rather "crunchy" consonant cluster. Could it possibly be
> "clen"?
Sure. A Russian wd recognize it. Changed.
>
>> Already had pomni for remember. And can have pinmo for forget
>>
>> Changed gwan (observe) to buq, from Laotian.
>>
>> What would the difference be between vinble and vinkin. Wd they both mean
>> visible? If so, can we dispense with one of them, and have ble mean
>> possible and be a suffix also?
>
> You're going with the wrong English definition of "possible". "kin"
> would be in the sense of "might" or "maybe".
I think I see.
Now, what I need somebody to do is to go thru the vocabulary at
http://www.geocities.com/ceqli/Vocabeng.html
And come up with place structures, as well as, of course, critiquing the
words themselves.
--
>PLEASE NOTE MY NEW E-MAIL ADDRESS: rmay@hidden.email
> Rex F. May (Baloo)
> Daily cartoon at: http://www.cnsnews.com/cartoon/baloo.asp
> Buy my book at: http://www.kiva.net/~jonabook/gdummy.htm
> Language site at: http://www.geocities.com/ceqli/Uploadexp.htm
>Discuss my auxiliary language at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/txeqli/