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Carl Edlund Anderson wrote:
On 15 Aug 2004, at 17:32, Padraic Brown wrote:As I understand it, ie reduced to i before a and o in Spanish, so deus > dieos > dios. Compare with E(G)O > ieo > yo.
Daniel Bengoa wrote:
La vocal "e" de la palabra "Deus" es una "e" breve.Tenemos, pues, que "Deus" (con "e" breve) en latín clásico se ha convertido en "Deos" (con "e" abierta)en latín vulgar.D'oh! I should have thought more along those lines myself if I had simply remembered that the e in deus is short and subject to diphthongization to ie in Spanish.
I guess what had confused me is that I had been thinking about the derivation from PIE *deiwos and had been imagining a resulting /e:/ fromthe diphthong ... but going back to look at Sihler, I am reminded that PIE /ei/ normally goes to /i:/ in Latin, though possibly through some monothong between /e:/ and /i:/, and further w-deletion in some parts of the paradigm split it into /deus/ and /di:vus/ ... or something like that.
But if I retain /ei/ and /w/ in my "alternate Latin" (which I've given the English name Qurese), I need not split the paradigm, and can keep /deiwos/ as is (failure of /o/ > /u/ before /s/ and /m/ in final syllables is another of my intended archaisms :), which I kinda like.
Then i just need to figure out what to do with an /ei/ diphthong when I hit the Vulgar Latin changes .... my feeling is that it should probably turn into /e/, and thereby resist the short-e > /E/ > /ie/ style of diphongization in Spanish. But the /w/ would go on to /B/ and I'd end up with /deBos/. Unless I could think of another cunning way to get rid of the /w/ in VL ... eh, but at least it's interesting and different this way.
In any case, my Qurese are going to have named gods drawn from a Roman-style pantheon, and I was going to try to continue a PIE-style name with /djew-/ straight through. I could keep an semi-Old-Latin-style "Diows" > /djoBs/ > /joBs/, and then assume that -Bs- like -ps- becomes /ss/ > /s/, so /jos/. Though /Bs/ would only appear in the nominative, and some dialects, at least, might remodel a new nominative as /joBes/. That's not so far from "Iovis", so perhaps a Spanish-style descendant would simply be "jueves" :) and Catalan/Occitan-style "jous" :)
Cheers, Carl -- Carl Edlund Anderson http://www.carlaz.com/